Developer Meeting Notes: May 11, 2014
This week’s highlights: Epic Games is involved in reviewing FBX Game Character I/O, and Cycles is being integrated in Rhino!
1) Blender 2.71 targets
- Planning is still the same.
- Move to Python 3.4 is done now for all platforms. Sergey Sharybin checks on numpy for MSVC 2008 – might need to be compiled.
- Everyone will (should) be on bug tracker work now! At least check on the issues in your area.Next week we will check on test builds.
- Splash: proposal is to appoint three judges again who will pick a splash (or held a contest, their choice). The judges/makers of previous splash usually appoint new judges.
- Note: discussions on FBX game character I/O is on the bf-gamedev list, also Epic Games is now involved actively on reviewing and help.
- We still need more FBX testers and people providing good reports and example files.
- FBX Docs.
2) Other Projects
- Nathan Letwory has been hired by Rhino to work on Cycles integration, started working on c-api and c# wrapper now. First screenie:
- Next week: GSoC starts! Students: make sure you find our ways around on our lists and irc.
very nice! just tell me if moving to python 3.4 does not affect compatibility of plug-ins? will the scripts be backward compatible?
and also i have another question : isn’t cycles under the gpl lisence, and therefore it wouldn’t be linked to proprietary programs? and does changing the lisence type affect the user’s rights to edit and redistribute it?
A while ago they changed the license of the Cycles render engine so that it could be used within some other applications and also function as a standalone renderer as well, unfortunately I cant remember what the license was that they changed to for the cycles render engine but I do know it was a more forgiving licence allowing for people to integrate it into their proprietary software programme and also allowing them to I think to make changes to the render engine.
Hope this helps, and I have no clue on the python issue, but if there was backward compatibility issues with the addons that the issues would have already been noted if there are any and patches on their way if it is a problem.
http://www.blendernation.com/2013/08/26/cycles-released-with-permissive-license/
Cycles license was changed to Apache. Since there was such a small pool of developers (mostly Brecht) getting permission to change the license wasn’t too big of a deal.
thanks fot the answers, so the lisence changed before even i moved from 3ds max to blender!
i think switching to apache lisence will help cycles development when companies like pixar and disney and autodesk and the one who created rhino contribute in development
another question : does apache lets the companies to keep the modifications they make before compiling cycles and linking it with their software and to not share the sorce-code? i hope not
Rhino-Cycles
Oh what a surprise! Someone is interested to a feature with a specific function that is given out of the blender package as a standalone application. So now some people will integrate it in their workflow? Wow much wow. Many surprise.
But we still prefer our personal all in one package cause we are lazy to pass from a software to another like those losers in the industry do.
And in a short time blender will be able to make coffee, watch your dog and listen to the mother-in-law in your place. All in a single package.
1) Why should Rhino be perceived negatively here? Blender Foundation released Cycles as standalone for this very result.
Blender developers are positive about sharing Cycles with other companies, ideally because it can lead to some major improvements to Cycles itself, which can come back to Blender.
2) Our “all-in-one” package could stand to see some serious focus to one task at a time, instead of trying to be an everything-a-thon all the time. Blender tries to master so many areas that it never truly masters a single one.
3) Your overall sentiment is exactly what’s wrong with many among the Blender community. Blender community is one of the most unwelcoming, overly-paranoid, self-contradicting communities around.
One minutes folks like you whine about people not playing well with Blender and skipping their support of Blender, and then the next you’re throwing virtual stones at those taking what Blender offers to share and even some who extend their products with support for Blender (V-Ray, for instance, got an earful from you ingrates).
It’s no wonder Blender carries the stigma of being an esoteric home to xenophobic amateurs–it’s folks like you who give us a negative image around here.
Actually I never said that it’s a bad thing. I think this is an awesome thing.
Read the reply below to claas kuhnen to understand.
I could use Cycles in Rhino while designing in Rhino. And When done with my design, I can export it and create a Blender Render scene where I have more control for designing a scene.
If you are not a product designer better don’t comment on this topic – you obviously have no idea about our workflows.
You have no idea of what irony is man. ;)
Do you really think that I’m excited because blender will be able to make a coffee?
Probably you didn’t read fully my comment.
And that’s the explaination why I was using irony about this situation:
http://www.blendernation.com/2014/04/11/ton-roosendaal-ask-me-anything-today-1500-1800-utc/
I would not talk more about it because I was already called as troll, harsh, fight picker and whatever in the past here just because I dared to criticize the sacred choices of sacred BF. Not a good experience so I tend to keep my opinions.
And for the same reason I didn’t reply to Ton. You know… he generates enthusiasm with just a superficiale sentence and I did not want to spoil the party.
My ironic comment was just some kind of brag… useful only for me.
Now did you understand or are you too proud for a simpe “apologize”? :)
ok you are loosing me here with what you are writing or trying to say.
And no, I am not too proud, I am just direct. So if I am lost in translation here and offended you, no problem for me to say “I am sorry”.
I like these developer meeting notes, because it means that other companies in the entertainment industry like game developers and movie production houses like the ones used by Hollywood are starting at least to take blender seriously. Yes I know it is only one company integrating cycles but what you have got to understand is the amount of new customers that programme has that will be possibly introduced to the cycles render engine that didn’t know of its existence before, this is definitely going to raise the awareness of the cycles render engine and if it makes a good impression, increase peoples A) awareness of blender 3d and B) their thought of I as a professional programme to be taken seriously, and no doubt that the gooseberry project will go some way to achieving that as well if it is ultimately successful.
Oh and of course you know what happens when you knock over one Domino , the others will eventually fall.
I’m really excited to read that Rhino will use Cycles!
But I just don’t share the optimism about further development.
There are already a lot of users who prefer Rhino rather than Blender (for whatever reason).
I don’t think, Rhino users who never knew about Blender or Cycles before will get excited and consider working with Blender.
Why should they do so?
They love their program (Rhino) and they just get a great extra feature: Cycles, which is an amazing render engine for sure and also one of the fastest photo realistic ones.
So now there is less reason to busy with Blender, as you also don’t need to export an .obj, but you hold it all in one package and can render right away.
And if further developments (shaders, etc.) for Cycles made by Rhino will be available for the FOSS Community? Honestly I doubt that, sadly.
Please, can anyone tell me, where can I find the RhinoCycles? I would really like to try it out! Congrats, Nathan!
“Note: discussions on FBX game character I/O is on the bf-gamedev list, also Epic Games is now involved actively on reviewing and help.”
…The entire world just paused around me like:
http://oi62.tinypic.com/i2pxl1.jpg
Seriously, that’s the best news ever for me. I’m a licensed Unreal Engine 4 developer, and what’s been killing me is the limitation between Blender and UE4, since UE4 centers around the .fbx format. Better FBX support has become essential.
Well, now that Blender’s bettering its .fbx support, and now with Epic Games’ help, this seemingly-small feature is probably the biggest Blender news I’ve seen all year. This is great! I’ll need to join the testers now.
Here’s hoping Epic Games goes even further by helping Blender see integration of their Animation and Rigging Toolkit (A.R.T), as well–or, at least, providing a free standalone version of A.R.T. that includes support for developers using Blender in their pipeline.
Also, congrats to the Cycles developers, Nathan Letwory and the Rhino community!
Anyone worried about this should be instead proud. Rhino has a very particular niche that happens to deal a lot with realistic product visualization and digital prototyping for manufacturing. They rely on realism.
Rhino 5 has amazing modeling features but relies on a decent but fairly rudimentary in-built renderer. Usually, a Rhino user will likely turn to Keyshot for a solid rendering solution, but Keyshot is pretty pricey, and sometimes, you just want an integrated rendering solution.
Cycles finally gives Rhino users a well-developed photorealistic rendering solution, integrated right in Rhino. I’m sure Rhino community will gain a great respect for Blender developers, and their own developers will add some nice specialized developments to Cycles that might see their way back to Blender.
This is making Blender’s development relevant to the progress of some big names in the graphics industry, in turn making its developers as a definitive force in the graphics industry itself.
This is fantastic news for Blender.
Keyshot is limited and too expensive and very limited in its functionality.
I have VRay for Rhino as well but with the GPU in Cycles I stopped using it.
I really hope this will take off and make Rhino Mac/Win use Cycles and hopefully this also provides more traction and attention to BF.
VRay for Blender, Cycles for Rhino, finally Blender gets into the commercial world as well.
Just yesterday I finished with a new friend a design competition and he is a FromZ user and he was blasted away how much control you have in Blender and Cycles.
So KeyShot is out for him.
Strangely enough, I’m finding an inverse situation with Keyshot, which is becoming a turn-to tool for folks in the game industry.
Many folks I work with use Keyshot for quick presentations of next-gen game models and rendered plates for concept art, esp. with bringing in work from ZBrush. They want to quickly give a concept using a rendering options with presets. Cycles could be used towards such, only that folks in my line of work prefer presentation software that’s more ready-to-use like Keyshot.
The limited style of Keyshot is rather limited for product visualization, but right up our alley in game development! I hope that Cycles soon incorporates presets system, complete with a library, to extend its usefulness to folks who do happen to want that ready-use limited library of materials. Hopefully, the growing use of Cycles will better help ensure that such happens! Glad to see the standalone Cycles paying off!
I’m also hoping that Blender developers produce with the Blender Game Engine something similar to what Marmoset Toolbag does for game model presentation with a real-time rendering solution.
Most who use KS also in product design use it for only few minutes and need an interface that is simple fast and plug-n-play.
Sure for that it is actually a fantastic software and if you do not have much time to spend a blessing.
In my design workflow however rendering is not the last part of a process, but very often a tool for in-between design intent and material explorations and validation.
So having Cycles running inside Rhino would be fantastic.
At Whirlpool the designers use KS for their internal presentations. For public presentation then the 3D department with 3DMax takes over.
Yeah, for real-time presentations (to show how a model can look in-game), such other rendering technologies are dominant (like the real-time physically-based rendering of Marmoset Toolbag and Unreal Engine 4, for instance).
For rendering realistic elements to incorporate into concept art, or taking “beauty shots” of next-gen characters for promotional art, a lot of guys will keep Keyshot around. Primarily for presenting game concept art, promotional art, and look development.
Very interesting workflow with product design. Seems like Cycles is a beautiful match with Rhino. So fascinating how we in various fields of the graphics industry all use similar technology in such different ways.
That’s very true. Sadly in most ID schools they teach rendering as the last step in the design phase and not really use rendering much during the design phase. I think this might be related to that many teachers are not familiar with how much rendering just took off – specifically in the recent years.
Fortunately the head of the ID department gives me full control and trusts me that the students will get an up-to-date introduction into what is possible today and not just only workflows from the past.
Blender matured really well. Currently I use it on two furniture projects for concept development but also use the data I generated in Blender for Rhino / Fusion to build the manufacturing surfaces just with few mouse clicks. This combo works really fantastic. When we want to explore fabric pattern design we go into the sculpt mode and well sculpt the upholstery stuff.
After all softwares are just tools to choose from.
And then there are the SolidWorks is the standard people …